Any forms of gear that strengthen tendon's/ligaments?

SoulCard

yes, exactly...that is why test is run higher/week than the deca...

Caymen

What i have described with the deca and test cycle is going against the norm!, because we use test as the base for every cycle but you will have to do it the other way round!, let me explain a little better, if you primarily want to gain mass use test as your base every time period!, but seeing as you want to strengthen ligaments and tendons you will have to make a sacrifice and use deca as the base steroid!, because if you go with 500mg test and say 400mg deca your collagen synthisis will be extremley inhibited and you wont get the full effect of the tendon/ligament strengthening of the deca but you will gain the most amount of mass, so you need to reverse the cycle and just take enough testosterone to supplement your natural test but no more than 200mg allowing you to have the bare amount androgens you need to function near normal!, you cant have the best of both worlds im afraid so you have to make a compromise...use deca as the base and dont gain as much mass and you may suffer a pretty hard shut down and possibly have a struggle getting wood, but grow stronger ligaments and tendons, or go purley for mass and get bigger muscles and possibly have tendons and ligaments not nessesarly any stronger and they will be under even more stress with the new muscle!.

Like i said it goes against mass cycles but the primary concern is your ligaments and tendons so you could run this and strengthen them up and further down the road you could go for the normal cycle with test as the base.

you will grow some muscle mass with this type of cycle but it wont be as good as the test based cycles, the cycle should be somthing like:-

Deca
1.36mg per lb body weight or 3mg per kilo of bodyweight

so if you weigh 180lbs you would take:- 245-250mg deca w/k

and no more than 200mg test w/k

not the best for mass but should help in your quest to strengthening your ligments/tendons.

SoulCard

cayman, im not going to disagree with you because i feel you are right, however i am wondering that if he would benefit from any amount of test, regardless of test run above/below...in other words the collegen building effect of deca (even if run lower than test) would be protective enough to help him get past the joint issue while on cycle and still not be shut down, 200 mg is the standard HRT amount, but im not sure that would be enough to keep him "alive" given the introduction of deca...follow me on that middle part?

jarman

A few more questions for ya guys


Okay, so once I go off of deca, my tendons will be permanently stronger so that a test based cycle in the future would be ideal? Deca actually aids in the healing process itself? Or it just reduces the inflammation for the duration of time that you are cycling it, and then once you go off of it the symptoms return?

Also, I weigh in at between 162-165 (prob water weight here and there), so I should go with 225mg of Deca/week and stay with 200mg of test/week?

Is shut down painful? I've heard of guys talking about it complaining that they have trouble moving around because their nuts are so tender. What exactly does it feel like?

I have read some posts on here saying that if hair loss is hereditary, then gear will speed up the process. Is this the case? Or is there a possible chance of losing your hair with everyone who goes on it? And if so, are their any ancilleraries that would counteract this?

Thanks

Caymen

Yeah no worrys jay i see what your saying mate, if he were to run test and deca at ..lets say 500mg test and 400mg deca he would probably benefit from pain free workouts!, but not the best option for strengthening tendons because his natural collagen synthisis has been reduced by more than half maybe 2/3 because of the high amounts of test, admittedly deca will also raise collagen synthisis but it wont have the greatest affect as collagen has already been reduced by high test levels so they are both in effect contradicting each other, but using test and deca in the dosages recomended test 200mg and deca (dependant on body weight) 250mg you will gain the best collagen production from lower test and the best collagen synthisis and cross linking ability of deca!, at these dosages they both work in a synergisticle way to build bigger stronger tendons, the test is run upto 200mg because any more than this and the natural collagen synthisis will be reduced but staying within this amount could even increase collogen sysnthisis, also this cycle is geared towards mainly tendon strengthening and secondly mass so this is why it breaks most cycling rules as we know them.

Also for tendon strengthening running lower levels of deca than test is hard to do because the said best dosage is 1.36mg lb body weight or 3mg per kilo so this is why it has to be run higher than test for optimal results, the test in merely there to supplement your own test to provide androgens DHT ect.

i dont know if ive answered your questions jay because i babble on like an old woman sometimes

Caymen

1,yes they should be, at least while your weight training anyway.
2,The test based cycle in the future would be more feasible if your tendons are stronger!.
3,As deca is said to be one of the best steroids in producing cross linking integrity and increase in collagen synthisis in the tendons then this must indicate that it does play a role in in the healing process and not just a anti inflamatory effect.
4,Unfortunatly there is no garauntee that it will cure your problem permantly.. if at all!.

200mg TEST
225mg DECA

I have never had any testicular pain from being shut down!, its more of a psychological problem for me, it just feels like you have no motivation and generaly feeling down, getting an erection can also be a problem, but others may suffer differently.

If you are predisposed to MPB (male patern baldness) then im afraid steroids wont help, the theory is that DHT is one of... if not the main culprit in this process, but this can be counter acted by using finasteride!, this stops testosterone from converting in to DHT, but then you again may run in to problems in the erection department and also a loss in strength!, people that are not predisposed to going bald by using steroids dont normaly have a problem but some do expieriance thinning of the hair but it can return to normal thickness when steroids have been discontinued for some time.

And unfortunatley using deca and finasteride together has been said to have the ability to speed up hairloss!, wether it is true or not and if this is a concern for you just buy some nizoral shampoo as this has been shown to lower DHT in the scalp...so in effect sparing your hair follicles from DHT onslaught.

damn jarman when i said ask as many questions as you like a didnt know you had so many , keep em coming because jay123 has just phoned me and asked if he can answer all you posts from now on , only kidding guys its all good fun
right im off for a cuppa tea

jarman

Awesome, these posts are really helping out

Firgive me if I have asked you this before but saying that deca does in fact shut me down, HCG will most definately bring my testicles back into proper functioning...? Or have you heard of instances where people have had trouble getting their body's natural production of test back to the norm?

With smaller dosages such as these, do you think gyno will be a major concern?

And where can you buy "nizoral" shampoo?

- Really appreciating the help guys

Caymen

The HCG is your choice m8 but personaly id just get clomid for the PCT, its not a heavy cycle and the length isnt going to be for an extreme amout of time so you shouldnt have any trouble in that respect.

Gyno shouldnt be a concern at these dosages!, but it wouldnt hurt to have some nolva on hand anyway, if you dont need it you just save it for the next cycle, "Its better to have it and not need it.. than to need it and not have it! ".

you should be able to get nizoral from most chemists/pharmacies, from the UK.

Just noticed your from the states, so you will have to buy the 2% from canada, you should be able to order some online.

jarman

What were you referring to when you said "2%"?

Are you familiar with proviron? I read this is good to boost your libido while on a cycle.

Do you think it would be a good precaution to have HCG on hand in case I need it for PCT?

I would be injecting each test & deca once a week for 10-12 weeks correct? Is it better to cycle for 10 or 12?

Caymen

The 2% i was refering to is the active ingrediant "ketoconazole" in nizoral, in the US i think its prescription only, but you can order it from canada and you want the nizoral with the 2% ketoconazole content.

proviron is good for the libido but realy bad for the hair line!, basicly its just DHT (dihydrotestosterone) and its the last thing you want if you are trying to spare your hair line.

I would run this for just 10 weeks to start with, and wouldnt bother with HCG at the moment, just use clomid on its own or along side nolva through the PCT period, this then will give you a good idea of how your testicles respond, and then you will have a better idea for the future if you will need HCG with your cycles.

1-10 test
1-9 Deca
13-16-17 PCT

start PCT 3 weeks after last injection of test this gives you at least 4 weeks for the deca to clear your system and 3 weeks for the Test Enanthate, you cannot be deadly acurate as when to start PCT because the only way to truly know when the hormones have left your body is by bloodwork!, but these are roughly the times the majority go by.

I would run PCT for 3-4 weeks because of the use of deca, even though doses are low, If you still feel shut down carry clomid therapy on untill week 17.

Anything else your not sure of?