"The classic stack" - your views?

Anonymous

Guys, I saw this article on www.bodybuilding.com regarding the classic stack. Just wondering if you guys agree. Your comments much appreciated (especially from the more experience guys)

Some questions though
1) Why is Dianabol needed to kick start the cycle? What if one is not interested in fast initial gains?

2) Is this stack for the 'classic' BB look, how do you reduce the cycle (i.e. by time or doseage) if you are just looking for that little extra 'edge'. For example, I am trying to get as much as I can from diet/training/rest and then MAYBE topup with roids

3) Comments on this forum seem to favour a tapering off of Nolvadex, (Appologies if I have this wrong)

4) Approximately what percentage weight increase in muscle mass does a cycle like this produce and how much of this will be retained after the cycle. I realise that this is very dependant on ones lifestyle, length and quality of training etc.

5) How does drinking affect this stack (in health terms)

Sorry for all the questions and many thanks to all in advance!!!

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Classic Bread And Butter
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Week 1-10 Testosterone 500mg/week
Week 1-10 Deca-Durabolin 200-400 mg/week
Week 1-6 Dianabol 25-30 mg/day
Week 1-10 Nolvadex (If needed) 20 mg/day
Week 12-15 Nolvadex 40 mg/day

This is the epitomy of a mass stack, known as the bread and butter cycle. Testosterone here can indicate any long-acting testosterone ester such as testosterone enanthate, testosterone cypionate or sustanon 250. The dianabol is kept at 6 weeks due to its liver toxicity and added at the beginning of the cycle to boost strength and gains before the injectables start showing most of their merit, around week 3 or 4. All three compounds aromatize at some rate and Deca's progestagenic activity may agonize estrogenic side-effects, so its wise to keep Nolvadex on hand. At the sign of itchy or lumpy nipples, using 20 mg per day until problem subsides is enough. Nolvadex also has a stronger affinity for the estrogen receptor than clomid, eventhough they are similar compounds. So its actually preferred if you use Nolvadex post-cycle to bring back natural test. Its further obsolete to get clomid since you need Nolva on hand anyway, so you have it lying around. Starting at 40 mg and tapering to 20 over 4 weeks will boost natural testosterone after your stack to help you retain gains, because of the blocking of negative feedback mechanisms.

The stack is known for its incredible mass results and is employed by beginners and veterans alike. Beginners would probably consider lowering the dose, in which case its advised to lower the Deca to 200 mg/week instead of 400, rather than lowering testosterone which is the main compound here. Veterans would also note to keep Deca at 400 mg, but if need be increase the dosage of testosterone primarily (to 750 or 1000 mg/week) and if still needed bumping d-bol to 40-50 mg/week. At that point the need for Nolva is an absolute fact.

In this stack I personally would change the deca-durabolin at 200-400 mg per week to equipoise at 400 mg/week because it's a stronger and safer compound that doesn't allow for as much water retention or fat gain. The bulk noticed with Deca is a lot more impressive though.
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MrSkinny

By the way, that post was from me (Mr S) - never logged in! ops:
John

LM6000

No worries John, I think we've all done it at some stage!!!

I asked pretty much the same question a couple of days back, if you scroll down through the Steroids Forum you'll come to a thread titled :

Preparing to jump to the darkside

Have a look in here, there are some good answers and som ehints to help with the research.

Good luck Bud.

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DarkAngel

Hi mate,

Its called the classic beginner stack because that basically is what it is lol


Its what has been recommended for yrs to recieve max benefit for first time users because your first cycle will yield greater gains that most cycles you will try after it - this is why its dosed like so.


saying this you can opt for a lighter cycle such as just test and dbol and leave the deca for another time.

The reason dbol is used is because the test takes about 3-4weeks to kick in fully - there is no other drugs out there today imo that give as much results as dbol or adrol.The sheer size and shape is fantastic!


The term classic has nothing to do with the look just the cycle type - how u will look will be determined by training,diet and rest.


I like nolva instead of clomid as for me clomid is a soul destroyer and leaves you like an emotional rollercoaster


Gains on cycle will vary but a gain of 14lbs isnt unheard off but how much u will keep will be determined by pct,cals and rest post cycle.We grow when we rest and we cant grow without food


drinking on cycle esp with orals will elevate liver levels even more so drinking and using AAS isnt advisable.


Train hard,eat big and rest and u will grow - use milk thistle and ALA for liver protection and drink3-4 litres of water aday.

Anonymous

personally i wouldn't touch alcohol while on the dbol, if you MUST drink leave it to 1 glass, binging is totally out of the question, i'd also drop the deca and just go with the test and dbol, that is ample to see some great gains from a 1st cycle

redspy

For a first cycle I'd drop the Deca and use 500mg of test for 10 weeks and 4 weeks of dbol @ 30mg for a kick start.

Anonymous

1. The test is suspended in esters and these take 2-4weeks to kick in. If you are not interested in fast inital gains drop the d-bol
2. Just run the test with the Nolv and PCT
3...
4. It is dependant upon the users experiance,genetics, diet,exercise routine etc
5. D-bol is a c17 alpha alkylated which is highly liver toxic so it is better not to combine with alchol which is also liver toxic (liver could shut down in worst case) I would allways run Milk thistle with orals including PCT.

HeavY

I posted but wasnt logged in

MrSkinny

Thanks for all your help guys very appreciative . Basically, I have been training (on and off) since I was 19 (am 31 now). I have started back training hard about 3 months ago after a gap of near 2 years and am getting to the stage where I was before I stopped. I've never taken roids before, mainly cos I knew bugger all about but them so am just doing my research at the mo.

My first priority is the health aspect hence the reason for the question on dianabol. Am I right on thinking that this is the most toxic? Actually I have no problems with injections if they are safer (if done correctly, of course).

I think the hardest thing is going to be giving up drinking, lol, but no point in doing if half-assed I supposed!

Tell me guys, if I left out deca, what difference would the end result make, in terms of size and strength. What about with dbol?


Once again many thanks

DarkAngel

Hi mate,

Yes both dbol and adrol are both very liver toxic but ran in short cycles with liver protectants is fine.


Since you havent ran a cycle in a long time a simple test and dbol cycle will work great - you can leave the deca and add it next time