Preparing to jump to the darkside

LM6000

Hey Guys,

As some of you know I'm still researching AAS ready for a possible starter cycle next year (dependant on hitting my genetic limits, correct training, diet, rest etc)

In our more knowledgable members opinions how does this look for a basic starter cycle?
I'm not looking to put a massive amount of weight on but would like modest, quality gains.

My diet is pretty sorted, I'm eating 6 meals a day with a good split between protein carbs and fat.
I'm 32 at the mo. and have been training consistently for the last 4 years (although sporadically since early teens upto 4yrs ago)
I'm 6'2" and currently weigh ~200 - ~210lbs (fluctuates) with quite a high BF ~20%.
The BF % I would like to drop to around 15% before starting any AAS cycle (At 15%BF I don't look too skinny or too fat).
Workouts, I generally do heavy low rep workouts hitting each major body part twice a week with ~30-45mins of CV work usually as a warm up and warm down.

Finally (!) the cycle I was thinking of is :

16 Weeks total (inc PCT)

Wks 1-10 Test En @ 500mg pw split into 2 x 250mg doses Mon & Thurs
Wks 6-10 Oral Winstrol @ 25/50mg pd (not too sure on doseage)
Wks 1-12 Nolva @ 10mg pd (I am concerned about gyno - 1200mg pd of 4AD gave me itchy, puffy nipples)
Wks 1-16 Proviron @ 25mg pd (again for oestrogen control / water retention)
Wks 12-14 Nolva @ 40mg pd (PCT)
Wks 15-16 Nolva @ 20mg pd (PCT)

Would using HCG and clomid be advisable and if so at what doseage and when?

Guys, many thanks for reading this post and if there is any more info. needed then please give me a shout and I'll advise.

LM

Anonymous

500 test isn't much mate, I just recently finished a cycle of that and found taking nolva during it a waste, I stop after 2 weeks and had no water retention as I just drank loads of fluids, again with the proviron, wait until you see how your body reacts to the test before using it.

If your trying to build muscle I would lower the weights and increase your reps to 8-12.

Also remember AAS only really works when sufficient calories/protein are there, you will have to increase on what you eat, I went from 6 meals to 8 a day, it killed me as I was eating almost non stop but if you are going to the expense of buying gear then you'd want the best gains!

DarkAngel

Hi mate,

Your cycle is not bad but i would recommend a front load or an oral kick start -

Frontload - this is when u double your test dose the first week to reach peack concentration levels quicker (seems like alot but trust me its fine)

Oral kick start (my favorite) - 30mg a day of dbol for -6week - this weill bring you right on to your winstrol tabs

I would have nolvadex at hand bro and run the when/if you get signs of gyno - i would nt run them until you get these sides.

IMO hcg isnt needed on that dose of test bro.


This is how i would advise pct with nolvadex -

day 1 -100mg
day 2-11 60mg
day11-22 40mcg



Eat big,train hard and get plenty of rest and u will grow very well

garry8472

i dont think we should be encourageing guys new to takin roids to take them in to large a dose 500mg of enanthate a week is the same as i use and plenty for a first course however i would follow opex's advice and run the dbol wks 1 to 6 i'd recommend the same dose as well.

9519sam

so say i was going to do a 500mg a week cycly you think for the first week i should do 1000mg ?? and this is front loading?


Cheers sam

DarkAngel

Yes sam that is frontloading and there is aload of articles on it - i will see if i can dig some up.

I would still opt for the dbol kick start first over this though.

zx9rjas.

I agree with garry. 500 of Enanthate is ample in 2x weekly jabs. A shorter acting test like test prop needs EOD, susp is even worse need ED or 2x daily

Dont try and fit too much in in your first course. I sarted on 40-45mg of dianabol and one :shock: amp of deca a week, no test :shock: I made great gains in size and strength . Didn't lose after either. 8)

J

Stu21Ldn

Some good info on front loading

http://www.conversionboard.com/forum...ead.php?t=1748

redspy

The Test En schedule looks good, I wouldn't bother frontloading a long ester as you'll see little benefit - 4 weeks of dbol would be a good kickstart.

My only other comment is this cycle may be pretty harsh on your joints. Test can reduce tendon strength and Winny gives many people painful joints. Personally I'd add some EQ to the mix to help your joints. JMO.

Good luck with the cycle.

LM6000

Hi Guys,

Many thanks for the responses.

Yeah, I'd heard the winny dries your joints out pretty quick, I didn't know that test could reduce tendon strength.
I'd plan on supplementing with MSM/chrondotin (?) for at least 6 months before starting this just to give my joints as much support as possible.



I'm not too sure about this (Opex, you're a hell of a lot more knowledgable than me so bear with me here...) I'm not looking to blow up quickly - trying to explain any rapid growth could be tricky with work and I'm also concerned about running 10 weeks of 17AA orals, I'd be running Liv52 etc anyway but frankly 10 weeks of 17AA's scares me!

Thanks to all for the advice on the nolva, any thoughts on using HCG and/or clomid?

Guys, many thanks to you all for helping me sort this out - if I do decide to use AAS I want to make sure I'm doing everything correctly, safely and worthwhile.
You're a credit to this board and it's members.

LM